The goal of a manufacturer customer satisfaction program is to increase customer loyalty and repeat business. It may not display this or other websites correctly. I appreciate the help. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. I an having the same issues with my 2013 f150 ecoboost 116k started about 6 months ago. Did the re program- to no avail- the engine light back on. This campaign is for vehicles that had 21B10 S2 performed and had an engine shudder afterward. (CSP 21N03 and 21N08), Aftermarket Products, Reviews & Installation, Suggestions, Comments & Questions about the Forum. Recall letters were mailed to each affected vehicle owner On September 27, 2021. If your cam phasers are not noisy, don't fix stuff that isn't broken, obviously the earlier PCM upgrade was done that extends your warranty to 70000 miles and prorates beyond that, you don't have the shudder so not needed the 108 flash. PCM reprogram due to engine shudder (Program 21n08) The open recalls are unrelated to the transmission. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. Id look much closer at a CPO truck than the remaining 2nd hand market. When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. I brought my 2019 F-150 3.5 EB in for the recall. The cause of engine shudder can vary, but its often the result of an imbalance in the engine itself. Customer Satisfaction Program 21B10 was an extended warranty coverage on engine cam phasers on vehicles that had received a PCM reflash prior to December 31, 2021. . Summary of Related Cam Phaser Rattle Recalls: How Much Does Cam Phaser Replacement Out Of Warranty Cost? 5. I'm assuming this is like a TSB. Any shop with an IDS scan tool will be able to check your car for transmission codes. JavaScript is disabled. I'm a long-time Ford and automotive enthusiast, and I've been writing about cars for over 10 years. The situation is really bad with Ford now. It is not necessary to remove the two left valve cover camshaft sensors. Because the 21B10 has expired and the 21N03 is about to expire at the time of this writing, we need to explore what your costs would be if you needed to replace the cam phasers out of your own wallet. Check with your dealer to see if your vehicle is eligible and make an appointment for service. JavaScript is disabled. Took it to dealer said it was cam phaser issue again. This is the PCM update to prevent cam phaser rattle and will erase your tune. So they basically work 15 hours but get paid only 10 hours. While there may be other potential remedies for the engine shudder 21N08 issue, the PCM reprogramming process is often the most effective and efficient solution. . Because of this issue, your engine may shake or shudder. I have used premium fuel and it didnt make any difference. When the computer is programmed, it will erase this programming andthe vehicle will have to relearn your driving habits. Mine doesn't die like yours, but definitely a problem there. This can be caused by something as simple as a loose spark plug, or something more serious like an issue with the crankshaft or connecting rods. Hey all, I am looking to buy my first full size truck and very interested in a used F-150 3.5L EcoBoost, all because of being good in gas consumption and the amazing towing capability. Manage Preferences - It was program #21N08 PCM Reprogram due to engine shudder. Reliability is important to me. So i guess every 30k miles i am looking at $1200 bill..crazy this is not covered under warranty!!! Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. By logging into your account, you agree to our. Even with these known issues, the Ford F150 has an annual maintenance cost estimate of about $858 per year. Advertising - At the time of the PCM reprogramming, it may address the engine shudder 21N08 issue, as this issue is often caused by a problem with the PCM software. You may then need the cam phasers replaced through the 21N03 customer satisfaction plan. Manufacturer Customer Satisfaction Program Issued - Ford Expedition Forum If your Ford vehicle is experiencing an engine shudder, its important to get it checked out by a professional as soon as possible. Ford Motor Company will provide a no-cost, one-time repair under program 21N08 to return the vehicle's PCM to the prior calibration. I was looking at another truck earlier and noticed on the Carfax it showed a "Manufacturer Customer Satisfaction Program Issued". Now they say it needs another round of cam phasers. The engine shudders 21N08 issue can be caused by a variety of factors, including problems with the PCM software, issues with the transmission, or a lack of proper maintenance. There are several F150s, Expeditions, and Navigators that needed a PCM reprogram due to an Engine shudder. How can I verify my PCM is extended to 70k? I had the original work done under warranty 54k . The recall is for bikes with front wheels that can detach unexpectedly, posing a fall hazard to riders. Your car should also be outside of its warranty in order to keep from voiding a warranty on your car. Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. Ford F-150 Raptor General Discussions [GEN 3], Ford Raptor Engine Discussion and Performance Mods, Ford F-150 Raptor General Discussions [GEN 2], Hmmm? The PCM reprogramming process can help to prevent the engine shudder 21N08 issue from recurring in the future. These are technically not recalls but an extension of coverage if the customer has a concern and falls within the window of . My truck has 8600 miles on it currently. 21N08 update, So I do not know if should pull the trigger or not. make a purchase, we may earn a small commission. Your email address will not be published. The 21N08 PCM reprogramming is due to an engine shudder that was noticed by some customers. Ford is aware of this problem and has issued a recall to fix it. If your Raptor is experiencing engine shudder, you may need to have the PCM (powertrain control module) reprogrammed. Lincoln TSB 21N08 2019 Navigator | CarComplaints.com I have a new to me 2017 SCREW that I purchased about a month ago. I had the first PCM recall done too, but have an engine shudder issue. GEN 2 (2017-2020) Ford F-150 Raptor Forums, Ford F-150 Raptor General Discussions [GEN 2], Need some help ASAP Code P06B6/ Faulty PCM, Ford SVT Raptor General Discussions [GEN 1], Ford Raptor Engine Discussion and Performance Mods, Hmmm? The shudder may be felt during light acceleration, at speeds between 30-40 mph, and can last for a couple of seconds. This recall affects a variety of models from the 2012-2013 model years, including the Escape, Fusion, Taurus, Flex, Explorer, and F-150. I'm assuming this is like a TSB. It is difficult for me to get a price right now on the PCM reprogramming since it is still under warranty for a few more weeks, so most front-desk service advisors dont have pricing. Calling the dealer when I get back and having it looked at thanks for this info. Sorry my Ford pass just updated and now I have the 21N08 and 21N03. If it becomes corrupted or damaged, it can cause all sorts of problems including engine shudder. If Ford was serious about this they would offer customers compensation as Volkswagen did. Reprogram the PCM using the latest software level of the appropriate Ford . The transmission is responsible for transmitting power from the engine to the wheels. No matter what the cause of your engine shudder may be, its always best to err on the side of caution and get it checked out by a professional as soon as possible. Reprogrammed PCM - Now it Stalls | Ford Raptor Forum Both will appear on the carfax of every affected VIN, which includes 2017 to early 2020 models. If you click them and The three trucks I have looked at have had the 21N08 update, so my question is.If you were in my position, would you pull the trigger on any of those trucks? If the Carfax shows that the vehicle that you are looking at buying has already received the 21B10, then you may need to take it in for the 21NO8 reflash to revert those settings. We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites. Field Service Action: 21N08 "PCM Reprogram Due to Engine Shudder". This site allows me to test new tools, piddle around in the garage, and share the insights I get from flipping cars and houses. Program 21N08 Pcm Reprogram Due to Engine Shudder. Hey! Hello mjpatera! (2). So you need to verify with your dealership with your VIN that the recall repairs have been done. . Oftentimes, this engine shudder may be mistaken for a transmission shudder. Engine. Transmission & Electrical Issue - Flashing D, N, and Gears, The wheel nuts for the Expedition 2015 are not compatible with the wheel wrench. Two versions of PCM calibrations - the regular one (21B10) and one for if you experience engine shudders with the regular one (21B10S2). When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. From what the rep told me 21B10 needed to be done before 21N08 even though I have a FSA for 21N08. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Since we know what these issues are, you are safe to buy one of these Ford models. Surprised to not see a whole slew of threads or posts on 21N08. This repair is a one-time thing and is only offered until Janurary 1st, 2023. Was it stalling or did the auto shutoff just turn it off for a few seconds? Program 21N08 Pcm Reprogram Due to Engine Shudder . Buy or Avoid? 2nd Gen with #21B10 and #21N08 and - Ford Raptor Forum I had 21B03 and knock on wood I haven't had any negative side effects like I have read about The vehicle is a CPO but I feel like the selling dealership didn't do a great job looking it over, so I took to a local dealer in AZ (I purchased it in UT). Fords are equipped with an adaptive shift feature where the computer learns to adjust the shifting for a smoother ride based on the drivers habits. But unlike my previous trucks, this ones not going to be an overlander or rock crawler that needs to not leave me stranded in the middle of nowhere. There are several reasons why the PCM may need to be reprogrammed. Mine does this while at low rpms. There may be some less smooth shifting during this process. Your email address will not be published. At Ford Motor Company, we take vehicle safety and quality very seriously. In some cases, the engine may enter limp mode. @Stevec1129 I haven't had the chance to try this yet, but I'm really hoping this new recall I see for my truck fixes the issue. This condition is typically caused by the buildup of deposits on the intake valves and combustion chambers. If you own a Ford vehicle, theres a good chance that it has been recalled for a PCM reprogramming. I was looking at another truck earlier and noticed on the Carfax it showed a "Manufacturer Customer Satisfaction Program Issued". Contact Us - In December, I went in for the 21b10 - PCM Program for Cam Phaser Rattle. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. In this article, we will discuss the PCM reprogramming process, the root cause of the program, and the solutions to the issue. Fords brilliant idea was to revert the programming back to the original level. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. 1997 F150 stalls when defrost turned on full, Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information. When this happens, the engine can stall without warning and the vehicle may not be able to be restarted. This newer field service action 21N08 software update is designed to solve the motor shuddering problem caused by the 21B10 reflash. Cam phaser rattle back and check engine light on. This is because the PCM reprogramming process addresses the root cause of the issue and can help to prevent the issue from recurring in the future. The F150 is the best-selling pickup truck in Americaand has been for 45 years. I hope that you find everything you need on our website and that we can help guide you through all your automotive needs. If your car is experiencing engine shudder, it may be time for a PCM reprogram. Are CSP's only performed as needed? (CSP 21N03 and 21N08) Its usually most noticeable at idle, but can also be felt when accelerating. Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. If you have one of these bikes, you should stop using it immediately and return it to Walmart for a full refund. BUT..I have been reading a lot about the Cam Phasers issue and all of them getting the 21N08 PCM REPROGRAM DUE TO ENGINE SHUDDER update. Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -. The Ford/GM 10R80 is "defective"? Cookie Policy - This newer field service action 21N08 software update is designed to solve the motor shuddering problem caused by the 21B10 reflash. Hi guys, I am pretty new F150 owner (2019 new to me bought about a month ago) and noticed on my ford pass app that I have two notices in my recalls section: CSP 21N03 CAM PHASERS and 21N08 PCM REPROGRAM DUE TO ENGINE SHUDDER. This makes it easy for them to compare symptoms, find solutions and unlock the best-hidden features in their trucks. First off, be aware that CarFax may show these recalls whether or not they have been done. Cookie Policy - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information, https://www.f150forum.com/f118/field6275/index152/. - Anyone have any information regarding the new recall notice I just received in the Ford App. In some cases, a little bit of harmless vibrations is perfectly normal and nothing to worry about. This campaign is for vehicles that had 21B10 S2 performed and had an engine shudder afterward. Pcv Valve Ford 4.2 Liter V6 Engine Diagram . It is important to address the engine shudder 21N08 issue to maintain the performance and safety of the vehicle. If your engine does stall unexpectedly, try to pull over to a safe location before attempting to restart it. General discussion on the 13th generation Ford F150 truck. Proper maintenance is essential to keep a cars engine and transmission running smoothly. Im meticulous about my oil changes, every 4000-5000 miles using Amsoil 100% synthetic. How will this extend your powertrain warranty 2 years? It involves surveying customers to identify areas where they are dissatisfied and then taking action to improve those areas. When there are problems with the transmission, it can cause the engine to shudder. 2015 - 2020 Ford F150 - Are CSP's only performed as needed? 2. Diagram. However, the engine shudder is quite noticeable. Go back and tell the dealer is has a shudder. Ford TSB 21N08 2019 F-150 | CarComplaints.com The below is copied and pasted from this thread: 21N08 PCM REPROGRAM DUE TO ENGINE SHUDDER update. Copyright 2022 by MechanicsPick.com! I would like to hear from some of the owners which have had the 21N08 update done and see if their issues have gone away. Summary. Later that day, it stalled again when I was at a red light. At the worst, if the issue re-appears (low likelihood), you might end up out of pocket for a fairly affordable repair. By logging into your account, you agree to our, yes they are only done if the concern is present. Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -. You are using an out of date browser. If the PCM software is incorrect or outdated, it can cause the engine to shudder or shake. Only 21B10 has to be completed, 21N08 is extended coverage. Program #21N08 PCM REPROGRAM DUE TO ENGINE SHUDDER; . If it is, theyll likely recommend getting the pcm reprogrammed. They only pay the dealership 75-80% of the labor cost, and guess what, the technicians are the ones who have to cover the difference. While there may be other potential remedies for the engine shudder 21N08 issue, the PCM . Id like to know whats causing this as well. I called my dealership this morning and they said there was nothing to be done to the vehicle. We also share information about your use of our site with our social media, advertising and analytics partners. What is my next option? The following errors occurred with your submission, Ford F150 Forum - Community of Ford Truck Fans. Y'all better read that letter again. 21N08? - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums While there may be other potential remedies for the engine shudder 21N08 issue, such as replacing transmission components or performing other repairs, the PCM reprogramming process is often the most effective and efficient solution. LOL, Ford Raptor Exterior Modifications Forum [GEN 1]. I scheduled the initial step of the Cam Phaser Reprogramming about three weeks ago. I have a 2018, just got the same notice. Honestly? The Ford/GM 10R80 is "defective"? 2019 F150 Shudder/Vibration | Page 2 | F150 Ecoboost Forum Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -. Hmm very interesting perhaps I should take it in and see if they will replace mine. One of the most common issues that you may face is to program 21n08 PCM to reprogram due to engine shudder. In some cases, the PCM may need to be reprogrammed in order to fix the problem. Privacy Statement - Gotcha. My goal is to empower more people to be self-sufficient. call your dealer and schedule an appointment. The benefits of reprogramming the PCM to address the engine shudder 21N08 issue include: By updating the software that controls the PCM, the PCM can better control the engine and transmission, which can help to eliminate the engine shudder. So far, the results are positive. The following errors occurred with your submission, Ford F150 Forum - Community of Ford Truck Fans, Aftermarket Products, Reviews & Installation, Suggestions, Comments & Questions about the Forum, Send a private message to VelocityBlue2020, Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information. They will uninstall and re-install the program using specialized equipment and software. The Program 21N08 PCM Reprogram is designed to address an engine shudder condition on certain vehicles. General discussion on the 13th generation Ford F150 truck. Has Ford corrected the Cam Phaser rattle in Gen3? However, the increased oil in the cam phasers may affect engine performance, especially when cruising at a steady speed. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. This new customer satisfaction program is designed to reverse engine shudder caused by this previous PCM calibration. Engine shudder is a vibration that can be felt in the vehicle's engine, and it is usually caused by an imbalance . So far, these recalls have been effective at solving the problem and improving customer satisfaction. LOL, Ford Raptor Exterior Modifications Forum [GEN 1]. When it comes to tools, home improvement, and being a shade tree mechanic, youve come to the right spot. Field Service Action: 21N08 "PCM Reprogram Due to Engine Shudder", Yep -- what ASV said. Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. I asked them to let me know if the Cam Phaser Rattle recall had ever been done to the vehicle and when I picked it up, they told me they did "RECALL 210B10" and the work order stated "210B10D Reprogram PCM to the latest level". This issue is often caused by a software glitch or by using incompatible software for the specific make and model of the car. might be auto on/off that truck comes equipped with, There is a new Recall specifically for this. There is a new Recall specifically for this. If your vehicle is equipped with the 3.6L engine and has less than 80,000 miles, it may be eligible for a free of charge power control module (PCM) reprogramming. Only detectable at a crawl speed. It was program #21N08 PCM Reprogram due to engine shudder. Is this related to the cam phaser reflash FSA? By addressing the engine shudder 21N08 issue, the cars performance and fuel efficiency can be improved. If you know how to fix it cheaply, then you might be able to get yourself a deal. Thanks! This can be done by a Ford dealership or an authorized service center. PCM Reprogram Due To Engine Shudder 21N08 - Tool Tally I had the original work done under warranty 54k miles. The 21N03 was the one I was thinking of. This is a free service and should only take about an hour or so to complete. I had 21B10 done last week on my '19. From what I have gathered my dealership performed 21B10 on October 1st (NOT 21N08 which is supposed to be a factory roll back). Manage Preferences - This PCM update is program 21B10. By updating the software that controls the PCM, the PCM can better control the engine and transmission. If you own one of these affected vehicles, you should take it to your local dealership as soon as possible to have the ECM reprogrammed. The engine shudders 21N08 issue is a problem that causes the engine to shake or shudder. I will see what I can do to assist with this acceleration concern. 21n08 - PCM reprogram due to engine shudder. I am actually looking to buy my first F150 3.5L EcoBoost, as a used truck, but have seen a lot of posts regarding the. This generally only affects a low percentage of vehicles that received the 21B10 flash. Has anyone had FSA 21N08 reflash done yet? | Page 4 | Ford Expedition Forum

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